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Post by gerd on Jun 5, 2016 0:42:16 GMT -5
BR232 with soundSpeaking to the specialist it is simply not enough space even in the E8 shell, so chassis too big or electronic components too big. Either way we have to wait a bit longer
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Post by Curn on Jun 19, 2016 0:38:56 GMT -5
Pretty cool video! Wish they showed how they fit the decoder inside. It starts with tinkerers showing that it is possible. It will take time for the tech to filter down to the DCC decoder manufacturers. The component density in smart phones today is what is needed. It will probably take another 10 years before we have drop in sound decoders.
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Post by gerd on Jun 19, 2016 2:09:57 GMT -5
Not sure what you mean with "they", but I can show you, BTW: it's a drop-in decoder. So it's down to AZL to make more space!  |
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Post by markm on Jun 19, 2016 12:25:42 GMT -5
It's an interesting design, but Curn is right, there is a lot that could be done to reduce the size of the unit: replace the mother/daughter board for a single board and use 21th century component technology such as: www.atmel.com/products/microcontrollers/avr/tinyavr.aspxIt would probably increase the cost by about 20%. The electronics should easily fit the AZL form factor. The problem is the speaker. Sound doesn't scale down as easy, although it seems that without the foam ring, the speaker could fit. I don't think that I would like to see AZL change their chassis. It would mean reducing the weight and pulling capacity of the locomotive for those of use who don't want a sound card and possibly lower reliability due to thinning the metal over the motor. Depending on the amount of reduction, it could also make the existing DCC decoders obsolete. Perhaps AZL could consider it for the brass designs, where money is no object to begin with. My two cents, Mark |
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Post by tjdreams on Jun 19, 2016 15:55:43 GMT -5
Being someone who has "tinkered" with putting sound into a AZL Z scale Locomotive I can tell you first hand fitting a sound decoder in a AZL Locomotive is not the hard part, For me the hard part is/was fitting room for a sound chamber of sufficient size to produce a quality sound at a Volume that can be heard more than a foot or two away. I've tried several speakers and while some were a tight fit it is possible to fit both the speaker and decoder in a E8. This picture from another thread shows both the speaker(foam removed for pic) and decoder in a Powered E8 chassis. And while it worked the volume was much too low to be heard at any distance. I've tried a few different speakers and tried a few different modifications. Several of the speakers were plenty loud enough with a sound chamber of sufficient size but as gerd stated their is simply not enough space with the current configuration. .  I haven't given up on the idea of putting sound in a Powered Z scale Loco. Its just that with all the other projects on my work bench I simply don't have time to work on it right now. |
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Post by markm on Jun 19, 2016 17:31:20 GMT -5
An alternative would be to design the sound chamber as part of the injection molded shell, as is done with a number of notebook PCs and I believe smart phones. Then all that you would need is the transducer. Of course the design would be different for every body style and would require a specific transducer. It would be an interesting science fair project but I think the cost would be prohibitive for model trains.
Mark
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Post by gerd on Jun 19, 2016 19:33:19 GMT -5
The sound chamber is definitely the key, this loco, without the shell, sounds absolutely pathetic.
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Post by Curn on Jun 20, 2016 2:07:50 GMT -5
Sorry Gerd, I didn't realise it was your video or that it's a currently available product from Velmo.
The E and F unit frames could be modified similar to what David did above. There is quite a bit of material above the motor. There is also the option put the speaker in the fuel tank like what was done by Aztek Mfg. with their DCC frames for N scale.
I thought Z scale sound was a lot further behind. Maybe it will be here sooner than I though.
Matt
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Post by davestubbs on Jun 20, 2016 8:57:48 GMT -5
Here is how I got loksound decoder and 2 sugar cubes under an E8/E7. Sugar cube baffle sanded down. smaller chamber but really did help. Cut down circuit board for easy servicing.   |
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Post by boxcarwilly on Jun 20, 2016 11:24:26 GMT -5
I'm certainly no expert on this subject by any means and this may have been touched on before, but would it not be more feasible to take a second unit, take out all the guts except for power pickups, remove gearing from the wheels, retool the entire inside so you have just a flat chassis and build your sound box on that. Then you can do something with the fan grates on the top of the body so that the sound can escape through them. To me, IF I were ever going make the attempt, that would seem to be the most logical way to proceed.
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Post by gerd on Jun 20, 2016 18:47:11 GMT -5
Dave, is this the ESU Loksound Micro V4.0?
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Post by BAZman on Jun 20, 2016 19:51:47 GMT -5
I was planning on lopping the top off the undecorated SD70's so that it would fit like Dave's. Modify the flared fans in the back or maybe a window-less cab (at least the side windows with Engineer Rick leaning an arm on the sill or waving to the Gentle Giants look down at him.
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Post by davestubbs on Jun 20, 2016 23:20:01 GMT -5
Hi Gerd, Yes it is a micro 4.0 here is the finished setup  |
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Post by QcKraag on Jul 21, 2016 9:54:12 GMT -5
It would also be nice if AZL designed a dummy chassis for sound and permit us to buy different skins  |
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