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Post by boxcarwilly on Apr 23, 2013 12:52:14 GMT -5
I'm not sure if I have a problem here or not but I recently purchased 3 different GP-38's from my dealer. This was over a period of 4 months. The first two have run flawlessly since I put them to the rails. However the newest addition is not performing like the other two. I got this last one just about a month ago and I had not even taken it out of the package yet as I wanted to try it out on my layout at a recent local train show. Long story short, when I installed it on my main line at the show, and turned the power on, it ran very, very slowly. Far slower, almost 2/3rds less the speed of the other two fresh out of their boxes. I figured that it just needed some running time to break it in being new and all, but the longer I ran it, it just seemed to maintain the same speed. I cleaned my track, put both the other 38's on spaced about a foot apart and let them run. The slower one being in the rear, was literally left in the dust by the first two. In fact, the other two did the full layout and caught up to the third one before it had a chance to get completely around the loop. This is very distressing. I took the slow one off, and let the other two go and they ran and ran and ran with no problems at all. I added 20 cars of mixed weight to each of the other two 38's on separate lines and they pulled their loads without even breaking a sweat. As for my newest addition, I could only pull 6 cars before it would just sit and struggle. I don't know what's wrong with it. Is it possible the chassis it put together a little too tightly and is restricting the mechanism from functioning? Is it a power pickup problem, I can't be debris of any kind or the other two would have problems which they don't. I wanted to use this 38 exclusively to pull the 8 heavyweights passenger cars, but it simply won't do it. Not even on a flat surface. The max it will pull of them is 2 and then it struggles to do that. I've also noticed that this particular 38 bottoms out on one of my turnouts which the others do not. Everything looks OK truck wise, but for some reason it scraps the bottom of the trucks just enough to cause a slight stall. Has anyone got any ideas on what I can do to solve these problems?
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Post by Rob Albritton on Apr 23, 2013 13:47:34 GMT -5
I'm not sure if I have a problem here or not but I recently purchased 3 different GP-38's from my dealer. This was over a period of 4 months. The first two have run flawlessly since I put them to the rails. However the newest addition is not performing like the other two. I got this last one just about a month ago and I had not even taken it out of the package yet as I wanted to try it out on my layout at a recent local train show. Long story short, when I installed it on my main line at the show, and turned the power on, it ran very, very slowly. Far slower, almost 2/3rds less the speed of the other two fresh out of their boxes. I figured that it just needed some running time to break it in being new and all, but the longer I ran it, it just seemed to maintain the same speed. I cleaned my track, put both the other 38's on spaced about a foot apart and let them run. The slower one being in the rear, was literally left in the dust by the first two. In fact, the other two did the full layout and caught up to the third one before it had a chance to get completely around the loop. This is very distressing. I took the slow one off, and let the other two go and they ran and ran and ran with no problems at all. I added 20 cars of mixed weight to each of the other two 38's on separate lines and they pulled their loads without even breaking a sweat. As for my newest addition, I could only pull 6 cars before it would just sit and struggle. I don't know what's wrong with it. Is it possible the chassis it put together a little too tightly and is restricting the mechanism from functioning? Is it a power pickup problem, I can't be debris of any kind or the other two would have problems which they don't. I wanted to use this 38 exclusively to pull the 8 heavyweights passenger cars, but it simply won't do it. Not even on a flat surface. The max it will pull of them is 2 and then it struggles to do that. I've also noticed that this particular 38 bottoms out on one of my turnouts which the others do not. Everything looks OK truck wise, but for some reason it scraps the bottom of the trucks just enough to cause a slight stall. Has anyone got any ideas on what I can do to solve these problems? Impossible to diagnose without seeing the unit and testing it. Strongly suggest you return it for replacement. We are happy to repair / replace defective units, but if you try to fix it yourself then your warranty is void. Best, -Rob(A) AZL |
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Joes
Fireman
Posts: 84
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Post by Joes on Apr 23, 2013 16:57:31 GMT -5
Check to make sure the fuel tank is properly seated. I have added two sided tape to a few of my various locomotive tanks over the years to keep them snug.
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Post by boxcarwilly on Apr 24, 2013 12:19:01 GMT -5
Hi Rob.
I want to try one more thing before sending this engine back to you. I'm going to try it with a different power pack. It probably won't make a bit of difference, but I want to exhaust all possibilities before sending it back. I also want to see if the fuel tank is the cause of the scraping.
I'll let you know what I find out.
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Post by ztrack on Apr 24, 2013 13:00:09 GMT -5
One suggestion. Check the trucks. Some came with way too much lube in the truck gearing. This could cause some binding and power pickup issues if the lube cover the contacts. Remove the trucks and check for the lube. Then test again.
Rob
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Post by boxcarwilly on Apr 24, 2013 20:14:11 GMT -5
Thanks for the suggestion Rob, but I'm very unsure about trying to take one of these little grabbers apart. I did that to one of my SD 75's and ended up with such a mess, I had to send it away to have it put back together again. I don't suppose these can be done without taking it apart?
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ZFRANK
Fireman
If you can't get it.....build it yourself....
Posts: 92
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Post by ZFRANK on Apr 26, 2013 16:29:06 GMT -5
Just remove the shell, put the chassis on a soft surface on its side, genly loosen the chassis scews a little . Now open the chassis a little, just enough to pull out the trucks.
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Post by boxcarwilly on Apr 29, 2013 10:59:14 GMT -5
Well I've done all the experimenting I can with this engine except taking it apart and I'm not going to do that since it will void the warranty. so the only choice I have left is to send it back to AZL for further testing or whatever. This is so disappointing. Out of three 38's this one just doesn't want to perform like the others. I just don't know.
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Post by catt on May 1, 2013 16:11:04 GMT -5
I had to return one of mine to Rob K. because it just quit working.He could not figure it out either.The replacement runs even better than the first ones I bought.
By the way food for thought.There was another Z scaler at the same show and his Marklin F-7 did the same thing my geep did but about 20 minutes earlier.'spose the Marklin jinxed the AZL? ;D
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Post by boxcarwilly on May 7, 2013 12:21:00 GMT -5
Rob.
My engine is on it's way back to you for inspection and repair or replacement. I did test it before I packaged it up. No change. It just won't keep up to the other two.
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Post by gprose on May 22, 2013 13:01:25 GMT -5
I've had similar problems with three (3) of my GP-38s. Funny thing is they usually run better in reverse! One of them however, experiences speed fluctuations when run in reverse (speeds up and slows down).
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Post by Rob Albritton on May 22, 2013 21:05:31 GMT -5
Funny thing is they usually run better in reverse! They all run about 10% faster in reverse. Not by design, it just happened that way. As best I can tell it is a function of the motor. |
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Post by boxcarwilly on Jun 2, 2013 9:36:01 GMT -5
Rob:
I got my 38 back a few days ago and tried it on my layout yesterday. I wanted to see if there was any difference in it's performance since sending it back to you. I am sad to report that it still will not keep up to the other two 38's. They literally run rings around it. If there was nothing wrong with this unit when you tested it, then why is it so much slower then the others.
In your private email to me regarding this unit, you suggested running it hooked to the other two. If the other two 38's were the same livery, that would certain solve my problem. You also suggested that the problem might be in my power pack. You mentioned several that might work better then the MRC Tech 220 of which I have 5. I have swapped out each of my 220's to determine if perhaps one might be better in power output then the other. After lengthy experiments, I saw no appreciable difference in any of them. As an aside, I tried running this engine in reverse and I could see no real difference in performance. Frankly, I just don't know what to do at this point. After the testing you did, I have to think that perhaps the problem is in my layout. But if all my engines, both AZL and MTL work very well as they are supposed to, then can that be the problem? I wondered if maybe there was a power drain somewhere, but ruled that out since 4 of my 5 PP's power separate lines and the fifth powers only signals, lights, turnouts and other accessories. I must confess that I am at a complete loss here and unfortunately, I have no one locally who can assist me in determining the cause of this problem. Sometimes being a Z-scaler in a city of HO and N scale train buffs can have it's disadvantages.
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Post by davestubbs on Jun 2, 2013 15:13:04 GMT -5
If you have a meter please check the amp draw from both the fast engine and the slow questionable one if the engine is binding in the drive train it will pull more amps.
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Post by Rob Albritton on Jun 2, 2013 15:36:40 GMT -5
Rob: I got my 38 back a few days ago and tried it on my layout yesterday. I wanted to see if there was any difference in it's performance since sending it back to you. I am sad to report that it still will not keep up to the other two 38's. They literally run rings around it. If there was nothing wrong with this unit when you tested it, then why is it so much slower then the others. In your private email to me regarding this unit, you suggested running it hooked to the other two. If the other two 38's were the same livery, that would certain solve my problem. You also suggested that the problem might be in my power pack. You mentioned several that might work better then the MRC Tech 220 of which I have 5. I have swapped out each of my 220's to determine if perhaps one might be better in power output then the other. After lengthy experiments, I saw no appreciable difference in any of them. As an aside, I tried running this engine in reverse and I could see no real difference in performance. Frankly, I just don't know what to do at this point. After the testing you did, I have to think that perhaps the problem is in my layout. But if all my engines, both AZL and MTL work very well as they are supposed to, then can that be the problem? I wondered if maybe there was a power drain somewhere, but ruled that out since 4 of my 5 PP's power separate lines and the fifth powers only signals, lights, turnouts and other accessories. I must confess that I am at a complete loss here and unfortunately, I have no one locally who can assist me in determining the cause of this problem. Sometimes being a Z-scaler in a city of HO and N scale train buffs can have it's disadvantages. Hi Ken, Rob Kluz sent me a copy of the report on your GP38-2. On his test bench, it ran within 1.8% of specification for speed and 2.3% for consistency. That is well within our tolerances, and is consistent because it is run on the same test track as all GP38-2 locomotives that get tested. While I wish we could be of more assistance to you, we are also at a loss to explain why you are experiencing such radically different results. Rob did tell me that he absorbed the shipping charges back to Canada, so I suppose that is the least we can do for you. Perhaps you can clarify one point for us: In your first message you said the loco in question ran "almost 2/3rds less the speed of the other two" (I assume this means that it is running 66% slower) but when you sent the loco back you said it ran "30% slower" than the other two GP38-2. Which one was it? It could be helpful in diagnosing the problem. Best, -Rob(A) |
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