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Post by markm on May 9, 2019 7:06:34 GMT -5
Having just travelled past a number of tunnels on the transcontinental route, I have a couple of thoughts.
Generally both ends of a tunnel are the same as they were built or updated at the same time. Adjacent tunnels may not be the same as they may have been built at different times.
Tunnel ends may be different because of different geology at the ends, i.e. loose soil vs. solid rock.
Specifically I might suggest using the same portals on the short tunnel in the upper left. On the others I can see going either way, it's up to you.
Mark
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2019 11:15:36 GMT -5
Thanks for Your answer. In fact I want perhaps to use "Rock" tunnels for the most left portals (including the left of the "short" tunnel"), we could assume that it is the same big piece of solid rock ... They look very "US-like", I read in another topic that in case of a solid block such portals were possible ... even in Massachusetts ?
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2019 15:23:47 GMT -5
Does anybody know "prototypical tunnel entrances" in natural rock in Massachusetts, or at least on the East Coast (Appalachian Mountains) ? Or should I really give up my idea of such beautiful portals ? Somebody (?) wrote that they are used to pass through a solid block of rock ; and they look very "american".
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Post by Rob Albritton on May 9, 2019 16:47:48 GMT -5
Does anybody know "prototypical tunnel entrances" in natural rock in Massachusetts, or at least on the East Coast (Appalachian Mountains) ? Or should I really give up my idea of such beautiful portals ? Somebody (?) wrote that they are used to pass through a solid block of rock ; and they look very "american". Do you mean something like this?
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Post by markm on May 9, 2019 19:37:05 GMT -5
Or something like this? This is noted as being a CSX tunnel.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2019 0:30:40 GMT -5
Thanks Mark : I was meaning something rather like the CSX tunnel ... I saw on the map that CSX has some lines in Massachusetts too, they look like former ... NYC's and NH's ! So it would not be impossible that such tunnels can be found there ; and they were created when CSX didn't yet exist. I love such portals, because they look very "american" ! If my layout is not absolutely "prototypical", I want that it looks at least "typical".
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Post by markm on May 10, 2019 6:29:04 GMT -5
Although I'm familiar with several tunnels like this, I'm not sure I would call it "typical." Both the geology and topography need to be just right for a portal like this to work. But it does look cool.
Mark
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2019 10:18:52 GMT -5
So I will use on the "upper" track the version by DeBenLLC and on the "lower" track the version by Zgauge.com, and avoid the "clone" effect.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2019 0:58:30 GMT -5
The most right portal will be moved backwards, to the straight section. Around 1980, when I built my former layout (I remembered now), I read that the topology should NOT be visible at the first glance ... So, putting the same portals at both ends of a tunnel would be in contradiction with this rule, especially for the most right tunnel (with the second portal behind the bridges). Besides this I think that mixing a "brown" ( = bricks) and a "grey" (random stones or concrete) for the two most right portals would look rather strange ; I saw that there are unfortunately no retaining walls available with the random stone models so there are supplementary limitations. Finally I think that I will build concrete portals for the most right ones, and brick portals behind the bridges and for the right entrance of the left "short" tunnel ; so at least the colours would fit approximately.
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Post by domi on May 13, 2019 17:18:45 GMT -5
A new question about tunnel portals : now I have 3 types of portals and will build 3 tunnels. Should I put the same type of portals : 1) At both ends of each tunnel, or 2) Side by side at each end of the layout (see plan here, You must be logged in) ; tunnel on the right "lower" track will be moved backwards, nearer to the second level portal. What would be more logical, and look better ? Thanks for any answer ... I guess there's no rule. If you consider one of the most famous tunnels in the USA, Moffat Tunnel on the former D&RGW (now UP) line from Denver to Salt Lake City, portals are not the same at each end. East Portal : And West Portal : Now, as for having to different tunnel portal samples side by side (for example after double-tracking an initial single track railroad) I'm not sure. I think I have some examples in my mind but I didn't manage to find them in Google pages. Hope the initial part of my reply helps... Dom
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Post by Commodore on May 13, 2019 22:33:32 GMT -5
A new question about tunnel portals : now I have 3 types of portals and will build 3 tunnels. Should I put the same type of portals : 1) At both ends of each tunnel, or 2) Side by side at each end of the layout (see plan here, You must be logged in) ; tunnel on the right "lower" track will be moved backwards, nearer to the second level portal. What would be more logical, and look better ? Thanks for any answer ... I guess there's no rule. If you consider one of the most famous tunnels in the USA, Moffat Tunnel on the former D&RGW (now UP) line from Denver to Salt Lake City, portals are not the same at each end. East Portal : View AttachmentAnd West Portal : View AttachmentNow, as for having to different tunnel portal samples side by side (for example after double-tracking an initial single track railroad) I'm not sure. I think I have some examples in my mind but I didn't manage to find them in Google pages. Hope the initial part of my reply helps... Dom Yep, that tunnel took four (4) years to finish. When they got to the other side, the store was out of the square kind ...so they had to settle for the other style portal to finish it.
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Post by markm on May 13, 2019 23:26:09 GMT -5
Woodland Scenic makes some cast random stone retaining wall pieces for HO & N scale culverts that might work for you.
And just to show anything is possible I noticed yesterday driving across Nevada the eastern portal of the transcontinental line west of Elko has had part of the mountain slide away and the portal is now free standing with several dozen yards of tunnel lining exposed (location: 40.718293, -116.011957). I'm not suggesting you model it, but it is interesting.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2019 11:26:49 GMT -5
The retaining walls by Woodland Scenics look fine ... but the stones are rather big in N scale, in Z these would be real boulders !
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2019 1:17:17 GMT -5
No other source for retaining walls with a "random stones" pattern ?
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Post by markm on May 16, 2019 10:03:51 GMT -5
Unfortunately it's products like this that come and go. You might want to look at ZTrains and Z Train Things (over on Monster Z) they have some retaining walls. Also there was (is?) one of the European accessory companies that made embossed plastic sheets of brick and stone. I found them handy as you could glue them to a curved surface.
Plastruc makes a number of textured sheets, but I think the scale may be a bit large.
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