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Post by trainboy4 on Aug 8, 2013 8:36:56 GMT -5
COOL
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Post by markm on Aug 8, 2013 19:36:47 GMT -5
Rob(A), Thanks for the research now I don't need to go to Sacramento to verify it. I've found a number of consist lists I've run across over the years to be inaccurate, wishful thinking or just plain wrong, so I consider them to be "unverified" until I get a good look at one of the Pullman or railroad rosters, or see it for myself in a tracable image. Perhaps I can throw out a couple more unverified stories I've collected over the years for people to comment on: ---A couple of small, unnamed roads had contracted with Pullman to run coaches (actually all their passenger service) for them. ---C&NW ran a couple of HW sleepers well into the 50's on the City of Portland/Portland Rose lettered for C&NW in Armour Yellow. ---After a number of cars were destroyed in a Nevada accident of the City of San Francisco there were a couple of HW cars painted for the train until they could replace the LW cars.
For the second two I should be able to supply some specific dates and possible car numbers when I get back home to my notes. Regardless, just a couple more colorful stories about Pullman and their cars.
Mark
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Post by Rob Albritton on Aug 9, 2013 9:20:14 GMT -5
Hi Mark,
I can give you my quick memory on those three, but I have not researched, so don't take this as facts: 1) I find that to be entirely believable, but what does operating a coach really mean? Sleepers need supplies and porters. Diners need food, cooks, waiters, etc. Parlor cars need porters, drinks, etc. I *do* believe that Pullman may have owned some coaches, and agreed to lease them to small railroads while providing maintenance and administration on them, but I would think the railroads would have still done the conductor work themselves. In the aviation business this is called a "wet lease" where the lessor provides everything to the airline (plane, maint, fuel) but the airline provides the crew and collects the revenue. 2) I'm 70% sure this is correct with Heavyweights - 99.9% sure this was true with Lightweights. 3) I have no reason to doubt that.
A more general note about Heavyweights: Coaches and Baggage cars lasted longer than any other type of Heavyweights. It was not uncommon to see Heavyweight Baggage cars up until the 1980s, and coaches lasted right up until Amtrak on several railroads. I just watched a great video of the Great Northern Empire Builder from the late 1960s in Orange and Green with a full Lightweight set *except* for the coach, which was a Heavyweight (also painted Orange and Green)
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Post by markm on Aug 9, 2013 11:00:32 GMT -5
Rob, Thanks for the data. Perhaps other forum members have some interesting facts on the heavyweights. I like to research the models I purchase so I can tell stories to people I show my trains to. The AZL passenger offerings (RDCs and heavyweights) have really opened my eyes and jogged my memory for passenger operations. Its been great fun.
Heavyweight coaches ran on the SF-San Jose commuter service until about 1984 as a substitute for the bi-level cars on the off hours and reverse commute trains. Cars were the SP medium grey paint. The cars are still running on Grand Canyon Railroad, some 90 years after they were constructed (I've ridden the cars on both lines). BTW I see that the Grand Canyon is also running some unpowered RDCs from the B&M. Looks like I'll have to go back there next year.
Mark
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Post by markm on Jan 11, 2014 12:57:00 GMT -5
Here's an "official" list of Heavyweight baggage, RPO and dinners in the daylight scheme: webpages.charter.net/altalair/sp_daylight.htmlFrom my print references, I have a reference for an unidentified 6-3 sleeper on through service to Nashville and a photo of a partial unidentified Daylight heavyweight on the Shasta Daylight that doesn't look like a dinner. But how about other western roads? The Western Pacific had their 300-series paired window coaches: www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=497891Note some of the 300-series were dining cars (300,301, 376 & 395) and although the image is a 2-axle truck, they were delivered with 3-axle. A more appropriate WP diner would be the 500-series cars, looks just like the AZL diner, as compared with the 300-series, which used coach sized windows. All these cars were in Pullman Green. These WP cars would have also been seen on the DRGW and CB&Q. When AZL releases the observation car, one will be able to accurately model trains such as the "Exposition Flyer" and "Royal Gorge". Mark
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Post by markm on Feb 8, 2014 11:52:58 GMT -5
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